OCP8 1Z0-809 Questions about topics that are not on the exam

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1Z0-808, 1Z0-809, 1Z0-815, 1Z0-816, 1Z0-817

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Robbie
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OCP8 1Z0-809 Questions about topics that are not on the exam

Post by Robbie »

I used the OCP Java SE 8 Programmer II Study Guide book from Jeanne Boyarsky and Scott Selikoff to prepare myself for the 1Z0-809 exam.

While taking my first test exam from Enthuware for 1Z0-809 I came a cross several topics that weren't mentioned in the book at all. Those topics are also not mentioned by Oracle in the list of exam topics or at least in some cases not explicitly.

Here is a list of topics not in the book and not in the oracle list of exam topics:
  • RandomAccessFile class Question enthuware.ocpjp.v8.2.1715, enthuware.ocpjp.v8.2.1717
  • DataInputStream class Question enthuware.ocpjp.v8.2.1774
  • volatile keyword Question enthuware.ocpjp.v8.2.1483
  • StandardOpenOption enum Question enthuware.ocpjp.v8.2.1541
  • wait() yield() notify() notifyAll() the book on page 326 specifically mentions that managing thread life cycles was on previous versions of the exam but not anymore on 1Z0-809. Question enthuware.ocpjp.v8.2.1225, enthuware.ocpjp.v8.2.1595, enthuware.ocpjp.v8.2.1514
  • ResultSetMetaData interface Question enthuware.ocpjp.v8.2.1347
  • SimpleDateFormat and Date classes. Book explicitly mentions (p240, p273) that the old way is not on the exam. Question enthuware.ocpjp.v8.2.1156, enthuware.ocpjp.v8.2.1191
  • FileSystem.getRootDirectories and FileSystem.listRoots methods Question enthuware.ocpjp.v8.2.1577
  • AWT Frame and Button this one was the strangest of all Question enthuware.ocpjp.v8.2.1443
It's frustrating to get 13 questions about topics that are not in the book on a single exam. I understand that on some topics the offical Oracle exam topics list is a bit vague. This probably goes for the FileSystem.getRootDirectories, wait() yield().

It would be very helpfull if I can get some feedback about the above list and if they really are or are not on the exam. It seems that some questions in the test bank are recycled questions from the OCP 6 or 7 exam which did include those topics?

Note that I have also use the book by the same authors for the OCA exam and your test bank. I had a better experience there almost no mismatches between the book and the test questions. I actually scored 92% for OCA thanks to the book and the Enthuware test questions.

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Re: OCP8 1Z0-809 Questions about topics that are not on the

Post by admin »

Hi Robbie,
I understand your frustration and I can assure you that we haven't included these questions in the question bank without any thought. Besides preparing the mock exams, we conduct classroom training as well and based on feedback received from our users and trainees, we update our question bank.
Some such questions refer to topics that are not mentioned explicitly in the exam objectives, yet, some candidates reported getting similar questions.

We have two options - either ignore such feedback, which may leave our users blindsided in the exam, or include the questions, which may cause frustration to users such as yourself. We have chosen to go with the second option because that way, at least we can explain the reason to the users. And studying a little bit more than required is at least not a bad thing.

We generally include a statement with such questions making it clear that they refer to a topic that is not explicitly covered in the official exam objectives so that users can make their decision about whether to put efforts in answering them. I see that it is not done for the questions that you've mentioned. I will coordinate this with the author and get is fixed asap. If there are questions that are really not required, we will get them removed.

thank you,
Paul.

P.S. The AWT related question that you mentioned above does look strange but is fair. It has nothing to do with AWT. You need to know about AWT only as much as you need to know about FooBar in a FooBar question to answer it. It is an inner classes related question.
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Robbie
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Re: OCP8 1Z0-809 Questions about topics that are not on the

Post by Robbie »

Thanks Paul for the reply. I will study those topics first before taking another mock exam.

I will try to update the list after taking more mock exams when I encounter more topics not mentioned in the book. That information is probably useful for other people who use the same book as preparation for the exam.

I also openend a topic on the coderanch forum to notify the authors of the book and ask for feedback of other users who took the exam.

I will post my own feedback in this topic after taking the real exam.

Robbie
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Re: OCP8 1Z0-809 Questions about topics that are not on the

Post by Robbie »

On page 157 the book mentions that the Map.computeIfAbsent and Map.computeIfPresent are on the upgrade exam but not on the normal OCP exam. Question enthuware.ocpjp.v8.2.1833 is about those methods.

Looking at the Oracle exam topics for the 1Z0-813 upgrade exam those methods are explicitly mentioned and on the 1Z0-809 they are not. Guess I'll learn them anyway to be save.

Scott Selikoff
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Re: OCP8 1Z0-809 Questions about topics that are not on the

Post by Scott Selikoff »

Hi Robbie. Even though this thread is cross-posted on CodeRanch, as one of the authors of the book you reference, I think its important readers of our book have the most accurate information.

Many of the objectives you listed were on the OCP 7 exam, but are no longer on the OCP 8 exam. Jeanne and I spent a great deal of time studying the objectives, as well as taking the full and upgrade exams, and have not seen any questions of the type you specified. As Jeanne said, we find it very unlikely that Oracle specifically removed an objective only to sneakily add it back in. We also listen to the feedback of our readers and discussions on CodeRanch and everything we have seen supports this.

In short, if we really believed these objectives were on the exam, we would have covered them or at least updated our book information page with additional material.

I understand Enthuware has 'received feedback from users that these topics are on the exam'. For that, the only thing I can ask who do you trust... the authors of the book who've taken four exams between them and studied the objectives and feedback from readers very closely for years now... or unverified feedback from users of software who you have never talked to? As I said in my post on Coderanch, its possible some mock exam providers recycle questions from the OCP7 exam, despite the fact that they are no longer on version 8 of the exam.

Robbie
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Re: OCP8 1Z0-809 Questions about topics that are not on the

Post by Robbie »

Thanks Scott for clarifying this. I also think that those topics are not on the real exam.

Unfortunately this makes using the Enthuware mock exams a bit more complicated as the score I get on those exams are not a good reflection of the real exam if they include topics that I haven't studied. I know that I could learn the extra topics to be safe but I'm having trouble already remembering all the API's that are in the book for OCP and would like to avoid adding even more to that if it's not necessary ;)

I also used the Enthuware exams for the OCA exam and I don't remember having any mismatches there. Together with the book it was a great way to prep for the OCA exam as the Enthuware questions tend to be a little harder than the real exam.

For the OCP exam I will still use the Enthuware mock exams because the majority of the questions are on topic and it is a good practice for me to use them. If the questions really are not on the exam I hope Enthuware will update the test bank to reflect this.

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Re: OCP8 1Z0-809 Questions about topics that are not on the

Post by admin »

We have reorganized the question bank and separated out such questions into a separate test itself (You will see an update notification when you open the question bank now). The topic titles of such questions now include the phrase "Not in syllabus" to make it clear.

Now, the standard tests will have questions only on topics that are listed explicitly in the exam objectives. Users who have time can go through other questions by attempting this test or by creating a custom test.

I would also like to mention that we are not fly by night operators. We have been doing this for 15+ years, which is more than the total experience some authors have...in Java :D

We will make sure that our question bank is the best resource for studying for this exam.
thank you!
Paul.
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Scott Selikoff
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Re: OCP8 1Z0-809 Questions about topics that are not on the

Post by Scott Selikoff »

The OCA 7 and OCA 8 were pretty similar with the differences being mostly minor. The differences between OCP 7 and OCP 8, though, are quite significant. The equivalent of entire chapters were thrown out and numerous previous topics were updated to include streams. For example, although collections didn't change too much between exams, there were a number of stream operations added to collections, making the topic much more complex.

Keep in mind that while the OCA exams tend to be general, sometimes with 5-6 questions about the same topic on the actual exam, the OCP exam is *much* more broad. You might see 3 separate objectives on a single question and no where else on the exam. Therefore, the differences between the two OCP exams are much more stark.

Anyone, good luck studying! Look forward to seeing how you do! Given the breadth of the material, we recommend you read the book twice!

Robbie
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Re: OCP8 1Z0-809 Questions about topics that are not on the

Post by Robbie »

I downloaded the updated version of the question bank and it looks good.

I think this solution is the best as users can still take the questions if they want to but since they are not included in the standard tests it will not effect the score of those tests.

Thanks Paul for the quick solution for this issue!

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Re: OCP8 1Z0-809 Questions about topics that are not on the

Post by admin »

FYI - There are a total of 5 basic questions on two topics (ResultSetMetaData and Map's computeIfAbsent) that our authors swear they saw in this exam. So we haven't moved them out.
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Robbie
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Re: OCP8 1Z0-809 Questions about topics that are not on the

Post by Robbie »

I took the exam today and I passed with a score of 88%

Of the topics listed above I got one question about FileInputStream.ready() and another question about the StandardOpenOption enum. I didn't get any questions on the other topics.

To prepare I took all the enthuware mock exams and was scoring around 75% on the last ones. So the book and the enthuware mock exams definitely are a good method to prepare for the real exam which is slightly easier.

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Re: OCP8 1Z0-809 Questions about topics that are not on the

Post by admin »

That's great, congratulations!
Thanks for your feedback :)
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